[judge-yu] Player Management Situations

[UDEbot]

we had a couple of incidents that occurred during the Pomona SJC and i would like to present these to other judges so that they can think about how they would resolve the situation if it were to occur in their event that is higher than the store level.

remember that at the store level we're trying to teach and inform, so accessing severe penalties on the players is not a good way to conduct our responsibilities.


Scenario 1:

two players are at the end of their duel. a player flips over Ring of Destruction targetting a monster during a player's draw phase of which they just drew their card.

the turn player comments that there's really nothing and that it looks like he's lost.

another individual passes, looks at the turn player's hand, and sees a Book of Moon in it (the card that was just drawn) and comments, "heck, just Moon it", then continues to walk past.

the turn player looks down, sees the Moon, and states that they are going to chain the Moon to the Ring.

the opponent calls for the judge and asks for assistance.


******************
Scenario 2:

a player forgets to search for a Sangan during their last turn.

now, the opponent notes that they forgot to search, and calls the judge over.
the opponent has already begun their turn, drawn, and summoned a monster.

******************

these incidents come up all the time.

do you penalize the player for commenting in the Scenario 1 before they actually looked a their hand? should players not even get into witty banter since they may say something that gives the impression that they are going to do, or not do, something? do you seek out the opponent, who may not even be in the event?

do you award a Game Loss for the player of the Sangan in Scenario 2? do you let them search?

there is never a right answer to any of these questions. someone is going to benefit, and the other is going to be penalized in some way. you should think about how you would resolve the conflict and then think of how you would justify and explain your solution.

just think about it....

- Gary Haynes
Level 3 - Yu-Gi-Oh!




Response:

Alright Judges, the phone lines are open. What do you do?

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Curtis Schultz
Official UDE Netrep
CurtisSchultz_Netrep@hotmail.com
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[DarkPaladin2k1]

Scenario 1:

two players are at the end of their duel. a player flips over Ring of Destruction targetting a monster during a player's draw phase of which they just drew their card.

the turn player comments that there's really nothing and that it looks like he's lost.

another individual passes, looks at the turn player's hand, and sees a Book of Moon in it (the card that was just drawn) and comments, "heck, just Moon it", then continues to walk past.

the turn player looks down, sees the Moon, and states that they are going to chain the Moon to the Ring.

the opponent calls for the judge and asks for assistance.

To this case, i would certainly declare the duel a loss for the turn player based on two things: First when the turn player draws, and declares himself defeated, even though he may have something to do, it seems that if he didn't check all his possibilities or in the case he is not aware of all the rulings and game mechanics and declares no answer to that card, it is his own responsability to know what could have been done if he has that particular card in his deck in first place(a common trend is that you know the rulings to the cards you use) , however it is also possible that he might have been startled by the card in first place forgot what he could do, yet it is still his call not responding to the card at the moment he declared that he had nothing.

The second reason is that having said he was not doing anything and getting the second opinion and last second advice is unfair for the other player, since he was the one that devised that play not the actual duelist involved, and also who can assure he knew what the other player had, if he was passing by he could have seen Both player's hands... thus it was an unfair move for the other player.

 

[John Danker]

Okay, I'll give my take on these situations....

Scenario 1:

First of anytime there is a situation that isn't a cut and dry ruling and depends on a judge's discreation any judge must take additional time and make sure to listen to each player's "story" starting with the turn player. During that time sizing up the situation according to what a judge sees beyond their stories may very well determine the ruling. What do people's tone of voice say? What do the eyes say? Are there other clues?
At this point a judge should ask any additional relavent questions. Sometimes, as with this scenario, a story may need to be interupted in order to bring in additional parties. The passerby who made additional comment should be sought out by another judge while the judge at the table in question continues there. The table shouldn't be left alone at this point as tempers can escilate and a crowd can gather. It's important to keep order and either player's friends out of the scenario and it's conclusion.

Once the passerby had been located and it's confirmed that the story told is as suspected first we give the ruling to the table to move the tournament along. In this scenrio I would have ruled turn player's comments as conceding defeat. This having been done the game is over. This ruling given with explination, praise, and thanks for calling a judge over immediately upon there being a problem.

Now that the situation at the table has been taken care of attention turns to the passerby. Determine of course weather that person is a player in the tournament. If no, explain the expectations of spectators and remove the person from the tournament area. If yes explain the expecations for player behavior and issue a game loss for unsportsmanlike conduct, and warn the passerby that any additional unsportsmanlike behavior will result in a disqualification from the tournament.

Sceanrio 2

Scenario 2 I consider to be much more difficult.
Explaination should first be given to both players that Sangan is a mandatory effect and that it is the responsability of both players to make sure mandatory effects are completed. It must also be explained that there is no "rewinding" of the game. That having been said, inform the players that each will recieve a warning for procedual error.

The explination having been given move to resolving the situation.

Though it is indeed both player's responsability to complete a mandatory effect it is ultimately the owner of the card who bares the brunt of the responability. As there is a turn in progress and what the non-turn player wishes to search for could effect the current turn I would give turn player the option of completing their turn before the other player searches or having them search at this time.


That's my story and I'm s..s..s..sticking to it!