Several Questions

[BURN]

1. Does Exiled Force get his effect when The End of Anubis in face up on the field?

2. What does the term destroyed mean? (Meaning when you tribute for a monster is the monster considered destroyed)

3. Player A has a face down Fiber Jar.
Player B has a face up Horus the Black Flame Dragon LV6 and a face down Divine Wrath
Player B attacks players a Face down Fiber Jar with LV6
Player A flipps Fiber Jar
Player B flipps Divine Wrath to chain to Fiber Jar's effect

After all that does LV6 get it's effect to level up to LV8?

 

[masterwoo0]

1. Does Exiled Force get his effect when The End of Anubis in face up on the field?

The End of Anubis does not affect Exiled Force. The cost of tributing Exiled Force to destroy a monster on the field is not a Graveyard Effect. It starts and ends on the field.

2. What does the term destroyed mean? (Meaning when you tribute for a monster is the monster considered destroyed)

A monster destroyed can be damaged by effects or attacks that deplete its defensive points (if in defense) or are higher than its attack power (if in attack). Monsters can also be killed by effects like Dark Hole, Raigeki, Zaborg the Thunder Monarch, etc. These effects "kill" the monster on the field, rather than just "remove" or "send" them.

Monsters tributed for bringing out a higher level monster, or used for effects that require a tibute are not "destroyed". They are "sent" to the Graveyard or Removed from Play. Unless the effect specifically states that the monster used for the tribute is destroyed, then it is only sent.

3. Player A has a face down Fiber Jar.
Player B has a face up Horus the Black Flame Dragon LV6 and a face down Divine Wrath
Player B attacks players a Face down Fiber Jar with LV6
Player A flipps Fiber Jar
Player B flipps Divine Wrath to chain to Fiber Jar's effect

After all that does LV6 get it's effect to level up to LV8?

EDIT: Fiber would be destroyed by Horus LV6. Then the effect of Fiber Jar would activate during the "resolve effects" portion of the Damage Step, but Divine Wrath would negate it. Since Fiber Jar was already destroyed as a result of battle after Damage Calculation, Divine Wrath would only negate his effect and not destroy him. You could Level Up Horus.

Hope that helps out.

 

[BURN]

1. If EF affect resolves on the field why doesn't Skill Drain stop it?

2. Thank you for the answer. This helps because there was a player trying to use the new FET panda and Rescue Cat to build up panda. to a 4500 attack monster on his second turn.

3. The reason I aske during a reginal event this weekend the head judge ruled due to LV6 causing Fiber Jar to flipp that Fiber Jar was basicly destroyed twice once by devine wrath and once by LV6 allowing LV6 to go to LV8.

 

[masterwoo0]

Skill Drain cannot stop Cost, or "Ignition Effects" from being made, so you can still send a card to the Graveyard for Tribe-Infecting Virus, you must still Tribute a monster for The Unfriendly Amazon, and you must still remove a Spell Counter for Armor Exe.

1. The only thing that Skill Drain does is negate the "effect" of a monster that is still "face-up" on the field when their effect would resolve. It does not prevent Cost or Ignition Effects from being made, so you can still send cards to the Graveyard to put a light and dark, etc.

2. It pays to know your cards. If you let a player cheat you knowingly or unknowingly, its too late to argue after the game is done.

3. Im not 100% on this one, but I would still rule that the Monster is destroyed before Horus can finish the attack.

 

[daivahataka]

3. Im not 100% on this one, but I would still rule that the Monster is destroyed before Horus can finish the attack.

Would it not already be tagged as destroyed by Horus since you wouldn't get to activate Divine Wrath until after the damage calculation, in the part where effects resolve?

 

[masterwoo0]

Would it not already be tagged as destroyed by Horus since you wouldn't get to activate Divine Wrath until after the damage calculation, in the part where effects resolve?

You're right, I was just getting ready to do an Edit. Fiber was destroyed because it was attacked and not flip summoned. The effect would kick in during the "resolve effects" portion of the Damage Step, and that's when you could activate Divine Wrath, but Fiber would not be destroyed twice since he was already destroyed. The effect was only negated.

 

[masterwoo0]

1. If EF affect resolves on the field why doesn't Skill Drain stop it?

2. Thank you for the answer. This helps because there was a player trying to use the new FET panda and Rescue Cat to build up panda. to a 4500 attack monster on his second turn.

3. The reason I aske during a reginal event this weekend the head judge ruled due to LV6 causing Fiber Jar to flipp that Fiber Jar was basicly destroyed twice once by devine wrath and once by LV6 allowing LV6 to go to LV8.

I think I gave a better explanation now.

 

[masterwoo0]

1. If EF affect resolves on the field why doesn't Skill Drain stop it?

2. Thank you for the answer. This helps because there was a player trying to use the new FET panda and Rescue Cat to build up panda. to a 4500 attack monster on his second turn.

3. The reason I aske during a reginal event this weekend the head judge ruled due to LV6 causing Fiber Jar to flipp that Fiber Jar was basicly destroyed twice once by devine wrath and once by LV6 allowing LV6 to go to LV8.

I think I gave a better explanation now. See my first post for EDIT.

 

[jdos]

1. The End of Anubis should negate Exiled Force. Exiled Force does activate in the graveyard according to the Skill Drain ruling.

"¢ "Skill Drain" negates the effects of face-up Effect Monsters on the field, but does not negate effects that activate in the Graveyard, such as "Witch of the Black Forest", "Sangan", "Mystic Tomato", "Giant Rat", "Exiled Force", "Sinister Serpent", and "Vampire Lord".

2. Already covered.

3. Horus Lv6 could level up. Like daivahataka said, at the point Divine Wrath negates Fiber Jar, it is already considered "destroyed" in battle by Horus Lv6. [edit]Oops, didn't see masterwoo0's edits

 

[masterwoo0]

1. The End of Anubis should negate Exiled Force. Exiled Force does activate in the graveyard according to the Skill Drain ruling.

I would be inclined to agree in "principle". Kind of strange though... You would think they would clarify it more as to show that it is a Graveyard effect, like,

"Send this face-up card on your side of the field to the Graveyard to destroy 1 monster on the field."

But that statment would open a whole new can of worms.

Stranger yet though, it mentions all those cards that activate in the Graveyard on The End of Anubis' rulings, "except" Exiled Force.

 

[daivahataka]

1. The End of Anubis should negate Exiled Force. Exiled Force does activate in the graveyard according to the Skill Drain ruling.

It activates on the field but the monster must remain face up on the field for the effect to be negated by Skill Drain, this is why chaining Book of Moon to flip a flip effect monster back down will allow the flip effect to resolve as normal inspite of Skill Drain being on the field.

 

[jdos]

It activates on the field but the monster must remain face up on the field for the effect to be negated by Skill Drain, this is why chaining Book of Moon to flip a flip effect monster back down will allow the flip effect to resolve as normal inspite of Skill Drain being on the field.

Well, according to the ruling, it does not activate on the field. It activates in the graveyard. The cost is paid by tributing Exiled Force from the field, but the actual effect does not activate until Exiled is in the graveyard. I know you can activate an effect with Skill Drain on the field and then BoM or Ring the monster for the effect to go through, but that's kind of irrelevent with Exiled. The fact is, Exiled activates in the graveyard. The ruling is in plain English and backs this up.

 

[novastar]

Well, according to the ruling, it does not activate on the field. It activates in the graveyard. The cost is paid by tributing Exiled Force from the field, but the actual effect does not activate until Exiled is in the graveyard. I know you can activate an effect with Skill Drain on the field and then BoM or Ring the monster for the effect to go through, but that's kind of irrelevent with Exiled. The fact is, Exiled activates in the graveyard. The ruling is in plain English and backs this up.

Lets put it this way... they are incorrect.

It's simple, ask yourself this... when you choose to activate Exiled Force's effect, where is it located?

in your Hand? in the Deck? on the Field? or in the Graveyard?

Bottom Line: regardless of what the Skill Drain ruling states, Exiled Force is without a doubt a Spell Speed 1 Ignition Effect that is activated on the Field.

Someone should really inform them of this error, it's a biggy...

 

[daivahataka]

Well, according to the ruling, it does not activate on the field. It activates in the graveyard. The cost is paid by tributing Exiled Force from the field, but the actual effect does not activate until Exiled is in the graveyard. I know you can activate an effect with Skill Drain on the field and then BoM or Ring the monster for the effect to go through, but that's kind of irrelevent with Exiled. The fact is, Exiled activates in the graveyard. The ruling is in plain English and backs this up.

Costs are paid at activation, not before, so Exiled is still on the field when it's effect is activated.

I assume you're refering to:

"Skill Drain" does not stop you from activating Trigger Effects, but it does negate their effects as long as the Effect Monster remains on the field. If you Tribute "Cannon Soldier" to itself while "Skill Drain" is active, "Cannon Soldier"'s effect is not negated because "Cannon Soldier" is in the Graveyard, but if you Tribute a different monster for "Cannon Soldier"'s effect, then the effect is negated and your opponent takes no damage. Likewise, if you activate "Winged Minion"'s effect while "Skill Drain" is active, "Winged Minion" is no longer on the field and its effect resolves. If you activate "Exiled Force"'s effect while "Skill Drain" is active, "Exiled Force" is no longer on the field and you can select and destroy 1 monster on the field. If you Tribute "Paladin of White Dragon" to activate its effect while "Skill Drain" is active, it is no longer on the field and you can Special Summon "Blue-Eyes White Dragon". If you Tribute "Great Dezard" while "Skill Drain" is active, it is no longer on the field and you can Special Summon "Fushioh Richie".

All it says is that Exiled Force is no longer on the field when it's effect tries to resolve, it doesn't say that it activates in the graveyard.
Remember Skill Drain negates the effect, not its activation.

 

[jdos]

Lets put it this way... they are incorrect.

It's simple, ask yourself this... when you choose to activate Exiled Force's effect, where is it located?

in your Hand? in the Deck? on the Field? or in the Graveyard?

Bottom Line: regardless of what the Skill Drain ruling states, Exiled Force is without a doubt a Spell Speed 1 Ignition Effect that is activated on the Field.

Someone should really inform them of this error, it's a biggy...

I don't disagree with your Reasoning, and it may be a mistake in the FAQ, but as long as UDE states that Exiled Force's effect activates in the graveyard, than EoA would negate it.

I sent in the following to the Judge's List, guess we can just wait and see what they say:

1. Will a face up The End of Anubis negate the effect of Exiled Force?
2. Where does Exiled Force's effect actually activate?
There is some confusion on where Exiled's effect activates. According to the Skill Drain ruling, Exiled Force's effect activates in the graveyard. This would make it possible for End of Anubis to negate it. However, Exiled is specifically left off the list of monsters with graveyard effects that are negated by EoA in the FAQ rulings for EoA. The case could be made for Exiled's effect being a spell speed 1 Ignition effect that is actually activated on the field. In that case the Skill Drain ruling would be a little misleading. Can you please clarify?

 

[jdos]

Costs are paid at activation, not before, so Exiled is still on the field when it's effect is activated.

I assume you're refering to:

All it says is that Exiled Force is no longer on the field when it's effect tries to resolve, it doesn't say that it activates in the graveyard.
Remember Skill Drain negates the effect, not its activation.

yes, it actually does say that Exiled Force's effect activates in the graveyard. Read the first ruling again...It specifically states that Exiled activates in the graveyard. It may be wrong, as Novastar said, but that's what it says.

"¢ "Skill Drain" negates the effects of face-up Effect Monsters on the field, but does not negate effects that activate in the Graveyard, such as "Witch of the Black Forest", "Sangan", "Mystic Tomato", "Giant Rat", "Exiled Force", "Sinister Serpent", and "Vampire Lord".

 

[daivahataka]

I didn't see that ruling, I thought you were refering to the other part, which I'd put in the post. It's most definitely a typo of some sort since you can't tribute it from the field when it's already in the graveyard and so we would have no way to pay the cost when activating its effect.

 

[novastar]

I don't disagree with your Reasoning, and it may be a mistake in the FAQ, but as long as UDE states that Exiled Force's effect activates in the graveyard, than EoA would negate it.

Yes, which is why it needs to be addressed and corrected.

 

[jdos]

I didn't see that ruling, I thought you were refering to the other part, which I'd put in the post. It's most definitely a typo of some sort since you can't tribute it from the field when it's already in the graveyard and so we would have no way to pay the cost when activating its effect.

Yeah, hopefully they'll clear that up. I would have ruled that EoA has no effect on Exiled's effect at all, were it not for that part of the Skill Drain ruling (which always struck me as odd anyway).

 

[daivahataka]

Yeah, hopefully they'll clear that up. I would have ruled that EoA has no effect on Exiled's effect at all, were it not for that part of the Skill Drain ruling (which always struck me as odd anyway).

Not the first time they've had typos in the FAQ and probably (and annoyingly) won't be the last. Leaves me thankful that the ruling of the Head Judge at any tournament is final, lets them use common sense and Reasoning to deal with these sort of hiccups on UDE's part.