Deathjester
New Member
Simply put, is it possible to effectively make use of 2 or more Heart of the Underdog cards on the field when you draw a normal monster with your standard draw or is it best to have just 1 of them active?
Clearing up the "missing the timing" ruling on Heart of the Underdog.
- Thread starter Deathjester
- Start date
There's no real advantage to having multiple copies in play. The last Heart of the Underdog to resolve will be the only one to trigger both copies again if another Normal Monster is drawn. So the end result will be the same as if one was in play.
That's not entirely true.
If you only had one copy, then you'd only draw 1 card extra each time you drew a Normal Monster card during your Draw Phase.
If you had two copies active, then if you drew a Normal Monster, you would draw two more cards. If the 2nd card drawn was a normal monster card, then you would draw two more cards, etc...
If you had 3 copies active, then if you drew a Normal Monster, you would draw 3 more cards. If the 3rd card drawn was a Normal Monster, then you would draw 3 more cards, etc...
So, having multiple copies CAN be advantageous. More drawing power IF the correct card drawn is a Normal Monster.
Hope this helps!
If you only had one copy, then you'd only draw 1 card extra each time you drew a Normal Monster card during your Draw Phase.
If you had two copies active, then if you drew a Normal Monster, you would draw two more cards. If the 2nd card drawn was a normal monster card, then you would draw two more cards, etc...
If you had 3 copies active, then if you drew a Normal Monster, you would draw 3 more cards. If the 3rd card drawn was a Normal Monster, then you would draw 3 more cards, etc...
So, having multiple copies CAN be advantageous. More drawing power IF the correct card drawn is a Normal Monster.
Hope this helps!
Yes, well, sometimes I tend to think in terms of what the card is trying to do (draw Normal Monster) and I forget what it can potentially do (draw lots'o cards). I'm forgeting about Exodia and the like.
I'm not sure what you just said, but here's how it works.skey23 said:
1. If you have one copy of heart and your first (normal) draw = normal monster, you can draw 1 more card. If 2nd card drawn = normal monster, you can draw 1 more card. If 3rd card drawn = normal monster, you can draw 1 more card, etc.
2. If you have two copies, and your first (normal) draw = normal monster, you can draw 2 more cards. If 3rd card drawn = normal monster, you can draw 2 more cards. If 5th card drawn = normal monster, you can draw 2 more cards, etc.
BUT: if, in #2, the 2nd card drawn = normal monster, but the 3rd was not a monster, you MAY NOT DRAW AGAIN. (I always hated that part!)
-pssvr
John Danker
Administrator
skey23 has the most easily understandable and correct ruling on the scenario.
only one Heart of the Underdog will work. If a normal monster is drawn during the draw phase (normal draw, Jar of Greed, Reload, disturbance stategy, Mind Wipe) the controller may reveal one(1) normal monster drawn and draw again.
If two Heart of the Underdogs are active:
Heart of the Underdog -> Heart of the Underdog
then Chain link 1 misses the timing
There is no draw 2 cards. The cards will be drawn one at a time
Having two or three will be pointless
If two Heart of the Underdogs are active:
Heart of the Underdog -> Heart of the Underdog
then Chain link 1 misses the timing
There is no draw 2 cards. The cards will be drawn one at a time
Having two or three will be pointless
John Danker
Administrator
I'll say it again, skey23's response is accurate and easily understandable.
Yes, if there are two Heart of the Underdogs active and you draw a normal monster they create a chain, you draw for Heart of the Underdog #1 and immediately following for Heart of the Underdog #2. If the card you drew with Heart of the Underdog #2 is a normal monster you will draw again twice and repeat that process (if desired) until you do not draw a normal monster.
It's not necessarily pointless. Which would you rather have when your draw a normal monster....to be insured of drawing at least two cards and have a chance at drawing four and perhaps more....or to be insured of drawing one card with a chance at drawing another one and perhaps more?
Yes, if there are two Heart of the Underdogs active and you draw a normal monster they create a chain, you draw for Heart of the Underdog #1 and immediately following for Heart of the Underdog #2. If the card you drew with Heart of the Underdog #2 is a normal monster you will draw again twice and repeat that process (if desired) until you do not draw a normal monster.
It's not necessarily pointless. Which would you rather have when your draw a normal monster....to be insured of drawing at least two cards and have a chance at drawing four and perhaps more....or to be insured of drawing one card with a chance at drawing another one and perhaps more?
OKay, apparently we need to revisit the rulings on this one.
Missing the Timing: Suppose you have 3 copies of "Heart of the Underdog" on the field, and draw a Normal Monster Card during your Draw Phase. All 3 copies of "Heart of the Underdog" immediately activate their effects, and because they activate simultaneously, they form a chain with Chain Links 1, 2, and 3. If you draw a Normal Monster card for Chain Link 3 or Chain Link 2, your copies of "Heart of the Underdog" do not activate again. This is because they are "when you can" optional Trigger Effects, and you "miss the timing" because you drew the Normal Monster Card during a chain and not as Chain Link 1. However, if you draw a Normal Monster Card for Chain Link 1, all 3 copies of "Heart of the Underdog" will activate their effects again.
You Draw for each Heart of the Underdog because each Heart of th Underdog triggred when you drew a Normal Monster at your Draw Phase. Otherwise there would be nothing here to form a chain link 1, 2 and 3. The "missing the timing" occurs when you draw these three cards and you pull a Normal Monster Card for Chain Links 3 and 2.
In order to Draw another card for Heart of the Underdog's effect, the very last thing to have resolved must be the drawing of a Normal Monster Card. The Draw of a Normal Monster for Chain Links 3 and 2 are not going to be the last thing to happen. Chain Link 1 is going to be the last thing to happen. So if you happen to Draw a Normal Monster Card for Chain Link 1 then all three copies of Heart of the Underdog trigger again. And, as we like to say, wash rinse repeat.
You always get to Draw for multiple Heart of the Underdogs as long as the last thing to happen was the Drawing of a Normal Monster Card.
Missing the Timing: Suppose you have 3 copies of "Heart of the Underdog" on the field, and draw a Normal Monster Card during your Draw Phase. All 3 copies of "Heart of the Underdog" immediately activate their effects, and because they activate simultaneously, they form a chain with Chain Links 1, 2, and 3. If you draw a Normal Monster card for Chain Link 3 or Chain Link 2, your copies of "Heart of the Underdog" do not activate again. This is because they are "when you can" optional Trigger Effects, and you "miss the timing" because you drew the Normal Monster Card during a chain and not as Chain Link 1. However, if you draw a Normal Monster Card for Chain Link 1, all 3 copies of "Heart of the Underdog" will activate their effects again.
You Draw for each Heart of the Underdog because each Heart of th Underdog triggred when you drew a Normal Monster at your Draw Phase. Otherwise there would be nothing here to form a chain link 1, 2 and 3. The "missing the timing" occurs when you draw these three cards and you pull a Normal Monster Card for Chain Links 3 and 2.
In order to Draw another card for Heart of the Underdog's effect, the very last thing to have resolved must be the drawing of a Normal Monster Card. The Draw of a Normal Monster for Chain Links 3 and 2 are not going to be the last thing to happen. Chain Link 1 is going to be the last thing to happen. So if you happen to Draw a Normal Monster Card for Chain Link 1 then all three copies of Heart of the Underdog trigger again. And, as we like to say, wash rinse repeat.
You always get to Draw for multiple Heart of the Underdogs as long as the last thing to happen was the Drawing of a Normal Monster Card.
BenjaminMS
The Kozaky show
You beat me, Jedi. I was going to use that rule too -_-John Danker
Administrator
<nodding> Yes, which is the exact same thing skey and I both have said. This thread has been answered multiple times correctly. Thread closed.
John, I was only one minute behind you. You posted seconds before I did.
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