My friend wanted me to ask this question, since honestly, I'm not even sure myself. How would Exchange of the Spirit work with Penguin Knight in either player's deck?
Exchange of the Spirit & Penguin Knight
- Thread starter CraniumX
- Start date
SO what does searching the stack mean and how did it apply to the conversation at that time?
He's not saying you "search the stack" he's saying that an effect on "the stack" (or in otherwords, on the chain) is allowing you to search the deck.
In short, he is saying that in other games mechanics and interactions, such as the "can" vs. "cannot" scenario are usually outlined very clearly in the main core rules. Specific card vs. card rulings are few and far between.
YGO on the other hand is done on a ruling card by card basis, so its not a BKSS, its because this is the first card to use the wording, and thus they never had to talk about it before.
Konami only outlines mechanics when the have to, and are terribly vague at that too.
In short, he is saying that in other games mechanics and interactions, such as the "can" vs. "cannot" scenario are usually outlined very clearly in the main core rules. Specific card vs. card rulings are few and far between.
YGO on the other hand is done on a ruling card by card basis, so its not a BKSS, its because this is the first card to use the wording, and thus they never had to talk about it before.
Konami only outlines mechanics when the have to, and are terribly vague at that too.
krazykidpsx
New Member
AHA!
See I knew I wasnt histerical.
and i counted, and its 11-12 becuase you only have enough room on the field for upto 5 spell or traps, not to mention once you go into spell speed 3 you have to stick with spell speed 3.
while in other games, in the chain/stack there is an unlimited amount and they all resolve in the same manner, from last to first.
so a chain can in the end go far beyond anything in yugioh.
there is an active trigger effect that states everytime you play a blue spell you gain 1 life.
so you play the blue spell so thats on the stack, opponent choses to counters yes or no, they chose not to, you add the life gain on the stack opponent then adds something else and so forth and so forth.
you arnt limited in number, only by how many cards you have in your hand and on the field.
and sometimes that could be alot.
like in VS. the new ALLY ability.
if there are 8 ally abilities that can activate, they all activate and put on the stack in order you want to use.
so in an instant you already jumped to 8 effects all at once.
in yugi, its not that easy.
which in the end means yugi doesnt have alot of flexibility as other games do.
and like novastar said
See I knew I wasnt histerical.
and i counted, and its 11-12 becuase you only have enough room on the field for upto 5 spell or traps, not to mention once you go into spell speed 3 you have to stick with spell speed 3.
while in other games, in the chain/stack there is an unlimited amount and they all resolve in the same manner, from last to first.
so a chain can in the end go far beyond anything in yugioh.
there is an active trigger effect that states everytime you play a blue spell you gain 1 life.
so you play the blue spell so thats on the stack, opponent choses to counters yes or no, they chose not to, you add the life gain on the stack opponent then adds something else and so forth and so forth.
you arnt limited in number, only by how many cards you have in your hand and on the field.
and sometimes that could be alot.
like in VS. the new ALLY ability.
if there are 8 ally abilities that can activate, they all activate and put on the stack in order you want to use.
so in an instant you already jumped to 8 effects all at once.
in yugi, its not that easy.
which in the end means yugi doesnt have alot of flexibility as other games do.
and like novastar said
NOvastar said:
Actually we've already established it can go waaay past 11. Leave Spell Speed 3s out of the equation and add in Emergency Provisions and the number can double or even triple. And don't forget continuous effects that can chain to stuff and Multi-Trigger Effect Monsters that can be used multiple times within a turn. There is no limit.
chaosruler
New Member
I count somewhere in 20+. You forgot Multi-Trigger monster effects. Each player could have 3 Strike Ninjas and 6 Dark monsters in their graveyards.
-chaosruler
-chaosruler
krazykidpsx
New Member
see your taking into considering there wont be a spell speed 3 flying around.
not to mention you would have to have 4 spell or traps that have to be able to chain to each other. in order to make Emergency Provisions effective, not to mention itll only be YOU activating quickplays from your hand not your opponent.
not to mention cards that miss their timing wont help out at all. see there is a limitation you just have to count.
lets make a sitution were its you going first, i only have 5 spell speed 2 type cards, spell and traps included. and you have lets say, 5 card hand, all 5 can chain to each other, which means they are all quickplays.
you have 1 normal, and 3 other chainable effects. per for example lets say its Heavy Storm, and you want to create a really insane chain.
so first you play Heavy Storm.
YOU Link 1: Heavy Storm
ME Link 2: Waboku
YOU Link 3: Book of Moon Targeting a face up monster
ME Link 4: HOrus 8 to negate it
You LInk 5: Scapegoat
Me Link 6: HOrus 8 to negate it
You Link 7: Rush Recklessly
Me LInk 8: Horus 8 to negate it
You Link 9: Emergency Provisions (From hand, to make room for the remaining 4 spells in hand)
Me LInk 10: Horus 8 to negate it
now we will stop here, because any smart person will know that chaining the remaining quickplays will lead to you wasting your hand and me negating, but oviously it would go to 14, with me only wasting 1 card. heck i didnt even have to waste that Waboku, and easily drop the Chain number to 13. but easily, notice that the number wont ever go that high if there is a quick easy negator on the field.
you wont ever get to a quick 20.
by the time you get to 20 you will oviously have to have a deck packed full of effects that are just speed 2 and nobody chains with a speed 3.
but we all know that its impossible becuase then you would have to be playing with your deck, which then would have to consist of using Emergency Provisions 3 times. which at the current moment you cannot.
but just for the sake to see how big a chain in yugi can get, we can say we use 3 provisions.
not to mention, that you cannot interupt the chain, unlike in VS or Magic.
once one card resolves you can chain to that and so forth.
not to mention you would have to have 4 spell or traps that have to be able to chain to each other. in order to make Emergency Provisions effective, not to mention itll only be YOU activating quickplays from your hand not your opponent.
not to mention cards that miss their timing wont help out at all. see there is a limitation you just have to count.
lets make a sitution were its you going first, i only have 5 spell speed 2 type cards, spell and traps included. and you have lets say, 5 card hand, all 5 can chain to each other, which means they are all quickplays.
you have 1 normal, and 3 other chainable effects. per for example lets say its Heavy Storm, and you want to create a really insane chain.
so first you play Heavy Storm.
YOU Link 1: Heavy Storm
ME Link 2: Waboku
YOU Link 3: Book of Moon Targeting a face up monster
ME Link 4: HOrus 8 to negate it
You LInk 5: Scapegoat
Me Link 6: HOrus 8 to negate it
You Link 7: Rush Recklessly
Me LInk 8: Horus 8 to negate it
You Link 9: Emergency Provisions (From hand, to make room for the remaining 4 spells in hand)
Me LInk 10: Horus 8 to negate it
now we will stop here, because any smart person will know that chaining the remaining quickplays will lead to you wasting your hand and me negating, but oviously it would go to 14, with me only wasting 1 card. heck i didnt even have to waste that Waboku, and easily drop the Chain number to 13. but easily, notice that the number wont ever go that high if there is a quick easy negator on the field.
you wont ever get to a quick 20.
by the time you get to 20 you will oviously have to have a deck packed full of effects that are just speed 2 and nobody chains with a speed 3.
but we all know that its impossible becuase then you would have to be playing with your deck, which then would have to consist of using Emergency Provisions 3 times. which at the current moment you cannot.
but just for the sake to see how big a chain in yugi can get, we can say we use 3 provisions.
not to mention, that you cannot interupt the chain, unlike in VS or Magic.
once one card resolves you can chain to that and so forth.
chaosruler
New Member
Fine...in order.
1: Opposing Dark Hole
2: Strike Ninja #1
3: Opposing Strike Ninja #1
4: Strike Ninja #2
5: Opposing Strike Ninja #2
6: Strike Ninja #3
7: Opposing Strike Ninja #3
8: Call of the Haunted
9: Opposing Royal Decree
10: Dust Tornado
11: Opposing Mystical Space Typhoon
12: Fiend's Hand Mirror
13: Opposing Royal Decree #2
14: Return from the Different Dimension
15: Opposing Emergency Provisions
16: Emergency Provisions
17: Opposing Book of Moon
18: Enemy Controller (Second effect)
19: Opposing Enemy Controller (2nd effect)
20: Enemy Controller (2nd effect)
need I go on? I just got 20 links right there. I never said how likely it would be, but it could happen.
-chaosruler
1: Opposing Dark Hole
2: Strike Ninja #1
3: Opposing Strike Ninja #1
4: Strike Ninja #2
5: Opposing Strike Ninja #2
6: Strike Ninja #3
7: Opposing Strike Ninja #3
8: Call of the Haunted
9: Opposing Royal Decree
10: Dust Tornado
11: Opposing Mystical Space Typhoon
12: Fiend's Hand Mirror
13: Opposing Royal Decree #2
14: Return from the Different Dimension
15: Opposing Emergency Provisions
16: Emergency Provisions
17: Opposing Book of Moon
18: Enemy Controller (Second effect)
19: Opposing Enemy Controller (2nd effect)
20: Enemy Controller (2nd effect)
need I go on? I just got 20 links right there. I never said how likely it would be, but it could happen.
-chaosruler
If both players had a face-up Ultimate Offering and a chainable Spell/Trap card in each other zone, five face-up monster cards with a Multi-Trigger Effects and two of those cards are Emergency Provisions, and a each player had six and seven cards in thier hands then the chain block could go up to ...
<calculates>
... hmmm... Assuming each monster was tributed for something chainable it could go up to 32.
<calculates>
... hmmm... Assuming each monster was tributed for something chainable it could go up to 32.
masterwoo0
NINJA4LIFE
Okaaaaay.... How did this thread turn into a discussion on ridiculously long chains????
I blame KrazyKid. <Points at krazy> <Walks away whistling>
krazykidpsx
New Member
Hey, its not just my fault, your the one that keeps saying its BKSS.
lol
lol