Curse of Anubis?

S

skey23

Council of Heroes
I've been reading other posts about things with this card and one thing has been said that confuses me. I would like to get this cleared up in my mind.

Player A has 2 two effect monsters in face up attack position.
Player B has 1 face down defense position monster and one set 'Curse of Anubis' from a previous turn.
Player A declares an attack.
Player B activates 'Curse of Anubis'.

What happens?

I know both of Player A's monsters will be switched to defense, and their defense reduced to 0.
But what happens to the face down monster? Does it get flipped up?
What happens to the initial attack? Does it stop at the point where the monster is changed to defense position?

It has been stated in other posts that a 'replay' would occur. How can this be possible when the number of monsters on Player B's side of the field did not change?

I don't have the 5.0 rulebook in front of me at this time, so I can't quote the 'latest and greatest' text on what causes a replay, but as far as I know, the attacking monster changing battle position was not a valid reason for a replay to occur.

Thanks.
 
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Digital Jedi said:
Boiled down to its most basic fundamentals, there are four things that make a card allowable in the Damage Step. Counter Traps is the on you already mentioned. The other three would be cards that specifically modify ATK/DEF, cards that have relevant text that only provide for activating in the Damage Step, and the infamous "Konami Said So"(s), which are cards that do not fit any of the above categories, but have a ruling that says "yes, you can activate this in the Damage Step".
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That being said I believe we are still awaiting actual confirmation from UDE that Curse of Anubis can or can not be activated during the damage step. Although part of it's effect does modify ATK/DEF it is even more questionable than Aqua Chorus and we've been told that that may not be activated during the Damage Step. The way I read it the primary effect is to turn the effect monsters into defense position, and it also changes the DEF of those monsters. I'm still leaning heavily towards "No, it is not possible to activate Curse of Anubis in the Damage Step."
 
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Slither, we've already established the fact that Aqua Chorus can activate in the Damage Step if there's two monsters of the same name on the field. We've already established that fact.

Curse of Anubis can't activate in the Damage Step because it isn't specifically modifying any attack or defense. Thus, it can't activate in the Damage Step. Simple as that. =/
 
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Tkwiget said:
Slither, we've already established the fact that Aqua Chorus can activate in the Damage Step if there's two monsters of the same name on the field. We've already established that fact.

Curse of Anubis can't activate in the Damage Step because it isn't specifically modifying any attack or defense. Thus, it can't activate in the Damage Step. Simple as that. =/
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When exactly was that established? The last ruling I was privy to from UDE said it could not be activated in the Damage Step.
 
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Tkwiget said:
Curse of Anubis can't activate in the Damage Step because it isn't specifically modifying any attack or defense. Thus, it can't activate in the Damage Step. Simple as that. =/
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That might pretty well be true (at least as how the card is worded), but the same thing can be said of Blast with Chain, and it still can be activated during the Damage Step.
 
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First off, Blast with Chain specifically modifies the attack of a monster by 500 points. It can activate in the Damage Step.

All face-up Effect Monsters on the field are changed to Defense Position. During the turn this card is activated, the original DEF of those Effect Monsters become 0 and their battle positions cannot be changed, except with a card effect.

That's the effect of Curse of Anubis. The actual effec of Curse of Anubis is changing all face up Effect Monsters to defense position. The original defense of those monsters becoming 0 is a condition that is lifted at the End Phase. Cards that change stat values of a monster that are worded like Curse of Anubis aren't specifically modifying any attack or defense at all.

"become 0" isn't specifically changing anything with any kind of stat modifier. Thus, it can't activate in the Damage Step.

And for UDE and Aqua Chorus, they make mistakes themself you know. They have in the past.

http://www.cogonline.net/threads.14825

That's the lastest Aqua Chorus thread that has been made. =)
 
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Blast with Chain wasn't the card I was thiking off, im not sure why I said BwC =P, i'll try and remeber what I card I was thinking off, and come back to that.

Now as far as Curse of Anubis goes, it has 2 sentences to it, but it doesn't wait for one thing to happen in order for the next one to begin like:
All face-up Effect Monsters on the field are changed to Defense Position. After the monsters have been changed to Defense Position, the original DEF of those Effect Monsters become 0 and their battle positions cannot be changed, except with a card effect.
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It just specifies that those monsters Def become 0.
 
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That's the effect of Curse of Anubis. The actual effec of Curse of Anubis is changing all face up Effect Monsters to defense position. The original defense of those monsters becoming 0 is a condition that is lifted at the End Phase. Cards that change stat values of a monster that are worded like Curse of Anubis aren't specifically modifying any attack or defense at all.

"become 0" isn't specifically changing anything with any kind of stat modifier. Thus, it can't activate in the Damage Step.
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the reason 'Curse of Anubis' can't be activated during the damage step is because of the first part of the effect, the second part IS an atk/def modifier, if not for the position change effect it could be activated in the damage step.

And for UDE and Aqua Chorus, they make mistakes themself you know. They have in the past.

http://www.cogonline.net/threads.14825

That's the lastest Aqua Chorus thread that has been made. =)
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also, 'Aqua Chorus' can't be activated in the damage step, because it's not a definite modifier, it only happens IF there are monsters of the same name on the field.
 
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And Aqua Chorus will only increase attack and defense of monsters "IF" there are monsters of the same name face up on the field.

"become 0" isn't a specific modifier in any way. You aren't giving a stat modifier to a monster with a definite amount. You're saying what is happening to the monster after the card is activated and is doing to the effect monsters it changed to defense position. One effect is dependant upon the other. The stat change isn't specifically modifying anything. That's why Curse of Anubis can't activate in the Damage Step.

Aqua Chorus can activate in the Damage Step "IF" two monsters face up on the field contain the same name. Thus, Aqua Chorus can activate in the Damage Step.
 
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Tkwiget said:
And Curse of Anubis can't activate in the Damage Step.
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"become 0" isn't a specific modifier in any way. You aren't giving a stat modifier to a monster with a definite amount. You're saying what is happening to the monster after the card is activated and is doing to the effect monsters it changed to defense position. One effect is dependant upon the other. The stat change isn't specifically modifying anything. That's why Curse of Anubis can't activate in the Damage Step.
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Mirror Wall =P','ycard','width=600,height=600'); return false;">

Ummm sooooo....... Mirror Wall =P
 
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Half and double, are not specific, they're just "exact" as 0 is an exact number as well, if you say:

"reduce the attack to 0" this would be equal or similar to say "reduce the attack by half" as they just find the attack and from that they reduce it to something exact.
 
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:mad_jedi:

Ok, this is retarded. I still say Curse of Anubis doesn't work in the Damage Step. The stat change Curse of Anubis happens after the monsters are changed to defense. I still believe the actual effect of Curse of Anubis and what it does is changing face up Effect Monsters to defense. The stat change is a condiction placed on the monsters for that turn as well as the manual position lock for that turn.

The difference I see with Mirco Ray is that it specifically is modifying the defense of the targetted monster.

Also Slither, Limiter Removal and Mirror Wall do specifically modify the attack. They "double" and "half" the attack of the monsters. That's specifically telling you what you're modifying the monsters with. Either 1/2 or by 2. It still is specifically telling you how much you're modifying the monster by.

Mirco Ray doesn't have any other effect by changing a targetted monster's defense. Curse of Anubis changes battle positions of monsters. Then it sets up a condition after the card has resolved that those changed monsters will have 0 defense.

I'm probably wrong anyway. XD
 
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Tkwiget said:
:mad_jedi:

Ok, this is retarded. I still say Curse of Anubis doesn't work in the Damage Step. The stat change Curse of Anubis happens after the monsters are changed to defense. I still believe the actual effect of Curse of Anubis and what it does is changing face up Effect Monsters to defense. The stat change is a condiction placed on the monsters for that turn as well as the manual position lock for that turn.

The difference I see with Mirco Ray is that it specifically is modifying the defense of the targetted monster.

Also Slither, Limiter Removal and Mirror Wall do specifically modify the attack. They "double" and "half" the attack of the monsters. That's specifically telling you what you're modifying the monsters with. Either 1/2 or by 2. It still is specifically telling you how much you're modifying the monster by.

Mirco Ray doesn't have any other effect by changing a targetted monster's defense. Curse of Anubis changes battle positions of monsters. Then it sets up a condition after the card has resolved that those changed monsters will have 0 defense.

I'm probably wrong anyway. XD
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I agree with you that 'Curse of Anubis' can't be used in the damage step, I just disaGreed with the Reasoning you gave :p
 
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Actually I think most of us agree that Curse of Anubis can't be activated in the Damage Step, because the modifier to DEF is a secondary effect and the primary is the turning them to Defense.

I don't agree with Aqua Chorus though. Officially all we've been told is that it can't activate in the Damage Step. I agree that UDE makes plenty of mistakes but in tournament until they change the ruling I wouldn't allow it. The thread you refer to actually discusses the fact that the ruling as it stands is that it can't be used in the Damage Step.
 
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I suppose so, but I'm not really that fond of making rulings on cards and situations when I know the ruling is vastly erroruous in basic game mechanics. I'll have to bite my tongue and move on. =P
 
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Doesn't it seem like we're playing word games with the cards in this case? It doesn't do it until after the first part of the effect resovel into play because it hasn't been activated on the twelvth of tommorrow. (!?)

From what I've seen in this game up untill this point, is that "specifically modifieg ATK/DEF" is a pretty clear term. It doesn't say "Exclusively modifiy ATK/DEF". We know thqat certain effects can half it, double it, "decrease it by", "increase it by" and "change it to" in the Dmaage Step. Why would a additional efect change it now, when it never did before.
 
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