Just some rulings I've been wondering about..

T

Tkwiget

Da Twiggy Man!
Was looking at my deck and was thinking of some ways that people would counter it and one card did cross my mind. Mystic Swordsman LV2. I use Legendary Jujitsu Master. So this is my first question.


Turn Player Normal Summons Mystic Swordsman LV2 and attacks Player B's face down Legendary Jujitsu Master, then wouldn't it be save to assume Legendary Jujitsu Master would never activate? Since it was destroyed by an effect face down.

Also if I activate Karate Man's effect and then activate Skill Drain after Karate Man resolved will Karate Man's effect be negated or just the part of it being destroyed?
 
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magnumcyclonex said:
I think this Damage Step Chart will help us better understand this:

http://lists.upperdeck.com/read/messages?id=1757.

Both monsters are included in this chart.
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It's not the timing of LJM's effect we're concerned with it just as to whether or not it even has an effect since when destroyed while face down it is just a card and has no effect, name or stats. (Think about why Levia is destroyed if flipped face down in chain to it's effect, why a Face Down monster equipped to TER via it's effect gives no boost and why Kotodama is only concerned with the face up cards)
 
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I've just posted the question to the judge's list. Thank you to all who gave their viewpoint on the subject.....<Howard Cosell voice> "Wording...it's ALWAYS the wording" <aging myself>
 
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I guess we'll all have to wait and see. LJM has been cropping up in various decks in my local meta now. We've just had a regionals in San Jose, CA on Oct. 8, and I'm glad this issue didn't come up (at least I didn't see it happening when I was judging). Thanks for posting the question John Danker.
 
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I'll attempt to break this up the best I can.

Legendary Jujitsu Master requires it to be face up when it is attacked in defense position. Mystic Swordsman LV2 activates and resolves at the beginning of the Damage Step. The card also prevents any card it attacks that's face down defense to be flipped face up. Legendary Jujitsu Master requires it to be face up, because face down monsters have no effects.

You might agrue that if you attack a monster normally that's face down that it wouldn't activate either. However, with regular monsters that attack face down monsters will flip them face up to enter the Damage Calculation portion of the Damage Step. This is exactly what Mystic Swordsman LV2 is preventing and even its effect prevents it anyway.

This is why Legendary Jujitsu Master doesn't return Mystic Swordsman LV2. Being destroyed face down means no effect for monsters that require them to be face up to activate and resolve.
 
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chaosruler said:
Legendary Jujitsu Master activates at the end of the Damage Step. It cannot activate when a Mystic Swordsman LV2 or a Drillroid attacks it.
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I know this was sent to the list, but I believe it was sent with regards to when a "Sasuke Samurai" or a "Mystic Swordsman LV2" attacks.

I have an issue with this statement regarding "Drillroid". If "Drillroid" attacks, the monster will still get flipped face-up, and by that time, you've entered the Damage Step (sub step 2). "Legendary Jujitsu Master" activates in sub step 6 I believe, so why would it not get it's effect?

[edit]Nevermind...the "D. D. Warrior Lady" ruling answers my question.....sorry!
 
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chaosruler said:
Legendary Jujitsu Master activates at the end of the Damage Step. It cannot activate when a Mystic Swordsman LV2 or a Drillroid attacks it.

-chaosruler
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Roar! Finally got to this!

XD Ok, Chaosruler I'd have to disagree with this subject. You want to know why? Because not only did Skey support my disagreement, but this is how I feel it does.

The Damage Step if my memory recalls correctly is broken up into six Sub-Steps. Four and Five are the Damage Calculations of the Damage Step. Since Legendary Jujitsu Master flips monsters that are face down to face up, LJM has the chance to activate and resolve.

Now if there's something that I've missed I'd love to hear it. =/ I know Drillroid activates the same time Mystic Swordsman LV2 does. I just want to know where you got the logic of LJM doesn't get his effect if Drillroid attacks it while its face down. =/
 
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I posted to the judges list a couple of days back as I run LJM as well as Sasuke Samurai - so needed to know. I have been ruling that LJM does not trigger as it is destroyed immediately (as per the card text) - so it is not on the field by the end of the damage step, and has no opportunity to trigger. I have also tried citing the example of monsters with triggers that can go off face down (the Gardna brothers for example).

The first ruling about LJM, though ambiguously worded, strikes me as being worded from the perspective of it being a face up card when attacked (..or flipped face down...).

The D. D. Warrior Lady was my argument for this effect not triggering. Also if it does trigger it opens a whole wealth of other effects:
Kangaroo Champ
Prickle Fairy
Kelbek

...to name a few similar cards.
 
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Good luck on the judge's list....I've been involved with a running thread on the L3 judge's list on this subject for a week....plenty of conjection from the other L3s but neither Dan nor Kevin have chimed in yet.
 
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