Enemy Controller question

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kansashoops

New Member
I just want to make sure this works as I think it does:

Opponent has one or more Scapegoat tokens in face up defense position. I have D.D. Assailant in attack position. I declare an attack on a token and ask for a response (assuming that my opponent has one or more cards set in his spell/trap zone). Opponent declines. I then chain Enemy Controller from my hand to the declaration of the attack, switching the token to attack position, and D.D. Assailant destroys him and does 1700 damage.

This is all kosher, correct?
 
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Tkwiget said:
Priority is only passed if not used when a monster is summoned that has an Ignition Effect. Such as TIV..



In the case of this example.

P1: Gemini Elf attacks. Activates Mystical Space Typhoon on face-down.
P2: Chains Mystical Space Typhoon with Magic Cylinder.

It is legal.

The game fact that's in motion is that Gemini Elf is the last thing happening. There for the timing of activation for Magic Cylinder is still correct. The entire Chain Block is being created in response to the declared attack, which Magic Cylinder is in a chain to.

There for, when you resolve the chain, Magic Cylinder resolves first negating and dealing damage. Then Mystical Space Typhoon resolves but the effect Disappears cause the target isn't there anymore.

I can't explain it anymore clear.......
Click to expand...

Ok, back to Tribe Infecting Virus. When if my opponent summons Tribe Infecting Virus, then activates the effect due to priority, when do I activate Bottomless Trap Hole?
 
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<rubs eyes and shakes his head>
I've never explained this stuff so much to the same group of people so many times. No offense, but continuously explaining it is driving me nuts..

What we're talking about are game facts. Game facts are things that the mechanics of the game see and register as an event.

A summoning doesn't eat up priority of the Turn Player, unless the monster is like Breaker. A summoning is a game fact. Since the Turn Player creates that game fact, it makes cards like Torrential Tribute, Bottomless Trap Hole, etc..work in chain to whatever the Turn Player uses for his/her priority action.

Whether that priority is used or not doesn't change the game fact nor timing of the cards that respond to that game fact.

So when the Turn Player summons Tribe-Infecting Virus and uses the Ignition Effect, that eats up the priority. The Non-Turn Player then can respond to the summoning with Bottomless Trap Hole, Torrential Tribute, Raigeki Break, Compuslory Evacuation Device, etc... The effects are put on a chain.

That's how it works, the game fact allows cards that respond to the event still have their activation timing remain valid and correct.

So with that out of the way, the whole,

P1: Gemini Elf attacks. Activates Mystical Space Typhoon on face-down.
P2: Chains Magic Cylinder to Mystical Space Typhoon.

is still legal..

You had P2's chain backwards when you typed it or if you got it from me, I must have typed it up wrong.

The game state sees that the game fact of a monster attacking is happening, there for it keeps that window of activation open for the first Chain Block only. After that, Magic Cylinder couldn't activate in another Chain Block.

Does that make any sense to you at all?
 
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I feell like TKwiget did a few days ago on that other thread that I cannot remember right now. But the lengthyness of this thread has me lost somewhat. And 'm not sure I'm graping all thats beginsaid from one post to the other from my lack of participation today.

The one point I'm not quite understanding here is the concept of priority on Attack Declaration. I don't recall it ever being stated that prority is retained after an attack declaration. While attacks have always created a similar response chain to summon declarations, they have never been completely identical.
 
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DJ, you've always been able to activate Magic Cylinder and Widespread Ruin in a chain to one another when your opponent attacks, whether he/she activates anything or not for their priority.

The timing of the card activation is still correct.

I'm getting some sleep, because explaining this stuff anymore tonight is just frying my brain. @_@ Jello anyone?

<goes and cries himself to sleep..>
 
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Don't misunderstand me, I'm not refering to the response declaration created. I'm refering to the retention of priority when an attack is declared. I've not seena anything to support that notion and I wonder it's just being extrapolated from the summon declaration mechanics and not on any actual eveidence.
 
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As far as I know there is nothing that gives you priority when attacking. (This game is different than VS.) In reality you are using your priority to call an attack. The original question has nothing to do with priority. If I attack my opponet then has a chance to respond. If they pass I have a chance to activate an effect. They then have a chance to chain to anything I activated. All of this should be in the rule book.

Unless something has changed in the last two months this should have been an easy question to answer.
 
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In this game, whenever cards/effects can be manually activated a player always has priority. So either the turn player has priority or the opponent has priority...

The only thing in the rulebook that ever suggests that priority is automatically to the opponent is when there's an event that can be chained to (and that last event was controlled by the turn player.)

All other cases of priority point to the turn player, so there's no reason to assume that anybody other than the turn player would have priority when an attack is declared.
 
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But the idea about retaining priority after declaring an attack has popped up several times on this thread, and it's being used in several examples. I fear that isn't an actual "attack mechanic", for lack of a better term, and it may be tinging some resonings.
 
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I know for a fact you cannot chain to an attack. But in all my studies, its always used your response priority. Different from the summon response, where I have priority to activate the effect of the monster just summoned (or have it used up by a manditory effect) or a Spell Speed 2 effect.
 
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Anyone have a rulebook handy or know where one online is. I need to look at the battle step. I always thought the opponent had the right to respond to an attack first. If not then I have been playing this game wrong for 4 years. Konami/UDE does like to change stuff.

Edit: I just look at a rule book and the only thing it says is both players may activated spell and trap cards. It says nothing about who gets to first. There is also nothing in the online FAQ about it. Where is this ruling coming from?
 
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As far as I can recall we have never gotten anything official on this little part of the priority situation. However by extrapolation of the other comments that have been made regarding the turn player having priority to begin a chain in each phase and the fact that declaring an attack does not use the chain it stands to reason that the turn player would retain that priority after the attack declaration.
 
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Morning everyone. >=) Gonna give this another shot after having my brain fried for a midnight snack.

I've always believed that the Turn Player has priority to respond first to any given event or what I call them, game facts. Game facts usually involve the game phases. Such as monster summonings and monster attacks. Giving a definate label of who has priority to respond first should always be the Turn Player. Why wouldn't the Turn Player wish to respond to their own attack?

However, the reason this logic of mine is being questioned is because you don't normally see people activating Mystical Space Typhoon, Rush Recklessly, etc. in response to their own monster attacking. Mind you, not normally.

The real question is, mostly because I doubt myself on this, is if the Turn Player actually does have priority to respond first to their own monster attack. It would make sense that the Turn Player would have priority to respond to their own attack because of how summonings are ruled.

I'm still saying that this would be a legal situation.

P1: Gemini Elf attacks. Uses Rush Recklessly for priority.
P2: Chains Dimensional Wall to Rush Recklessly.

To me I don't see how the Turn Player wouldn't be given the right to respond first to these events. Isn't that what being Turn Player is about? Having the right to use your priority to respond first to events before your opponent if choose to do so?


<loves having a clear head and ponders about getting some coffee.>

EDIT: Btw Blade, I'm basing my entire logic and ruling off of how the Turn Player retains priority after summoning a monster.
 
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*chalks another up to Tkwiget* You are correct. And I STILL say (don't know if this is being disputed or not, but you know how I can be sometimes) that if you have priority and there is something you want to activate, you had best activate it NOW, because if you pass and your opponent passes, this phase / step / chain / response window / whatever you're in is just plain over. Consider this:

P1 attacks, and wants to activate Raigeki Break (destroy target monster, trigger a replay), but *THINKS* that maybe P2's face down card is a Mystical Space Typhoon. If this is the case, P1 wants to pass priority, let P2 activate MST, and then chain Raigeki Break, thereby causing P2 to waste his/her MST. So P1 passes.

P2 passes back. Apparently the F/D card was not MST.

P1 activates Raigeki Break in the Battle Step.

WAIT!!! not a legal situation. Once both players pass consecutively, P1 cannot go back and un-pass!!! The Battle Step is OVER!

-pssvr
 
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That's correct, because both players in passing priority to one another without doing anything is sort of like an agreement to proceed to the next step. Shoot all the way through the Battle Phase mechanics, (forgot what Step 2 is...) to Step 3: Damage Step.

Sometimes I wonder why I'm even a judge. <laughs at his own frustration..>
 
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Right. I've heard some people say things like this:

P1 passes
P2 passes
P1 says, "Do you want to activate anything else this phase?"
P2 says, "Yeah, I do."

WRONG, WRONG, WRONG, WRONG!!! *breathe* that's it, relax...

Just to make sure everyone's clear (and I think they already are, but whatever...) passing priority is the same as saying you have nothing left to activate. If you have something to do, don't pass.

-pssvr
 
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Tkwiget said:
Morning everyone. >=) Gonna give this another shot after having my brain fried for a midnight snack.

I've always believed that the Turn Player has priority to respond first to any given event or what I call them, game facts. Game facts usually involve the game phases. Such as monster summonings and monster attacks. Giving a definate label of who has priority to respond first should always be the Turn Player. Why wouldn't the Turn Player wish to respond to their own attack?

However, the reason this logic of mine is being questioned is because you don't normally see people activating Mystical Space Typhoon, Rush Recklessly, etc. in response to their own monster attacking. Mind you, not normally.

The real question is, mostly because I doubt myself on this, is if the Turn Player actually does have priority to respond first to their own monster attack. It would make sense that the Turn Player would have priority to respond to their own attack because of how summonings are ruled.

I'm still saying that this would be a legal situation.

P1: Gemini Elf attacks. Uses Rush Recklessly for priority.
P2: Chains Dimensional Wall to Rush Recklessly.

To me I don't see how the Turn Player wouldn't be given the right to respond first to these events. Isn't that what being Turn Player is about? Having the right to use your priority to respond first to events before your opponent if choose to do so?


<loves having a clear head and ponders about getting some coffee.>

EDIT: Btw Blade, I'm basing my entire logic and ruling off of how the Turn Player retains priority after summoning a monster.
Click to expand...

Wait. This is just based on your own logic? This is not 100% correct because it is just your opinion on how it is supposed to work. Well now that just further complicates the matter. I need to find a higher level judge or at least get one of the judges to make another updated priority article.
 
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junky typoes!!! >=(

Note: Only a second response in the Battle Step can happen if a Chain Block was created and resolves in response to a monster attacking.

EDIT: So what you're saying is I have no clue what I'm talking about?
 
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